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  #21  
Old 04-02-2017, 12:37 AM
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That looks like a fancy boom stick. I just might need to start looking for a shotty. I love the versatility of shotguns too. The different style of ammo you can buy is crazy.
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Old 04-02-2017, 12:55 AM
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That looks like a fancy boom stick. I just might need to start looking for a shotty. I love the versatility of shotguns too. The different style of ammo you can buy is crazy.
i know right? i couldnt believe the guys prices. i bought like 4 weapons from him. when he said 50 for that shotgun i had to really concentrate to not smile and i did not want to stand up because of my erection. i got a 22lr mossberg ar clone and a 50 year old 22lr semi auto rifle, that shot gun and an m$p sheild 9mm for like 500$

that is a fact, flechettes, armor piercers, incendiarys, rifles slugs, pepper powder, also you can buy cheap bird shot rounds and make cut slugs, or a broom handle and bottle of gas ala the first anarchists cook book shotgun propelled molotov cocktail.

and here is my 20 year old idea for home made armor piercing slug for almost zero dollars. a simple 3/16 steel rod cut in 1 inch sections. center drill the slug and glue the bar into the slug projecting above the slug by about 1/8 inch. the bar would penetrate damn near any body armor and a lot of light vehicle armor or at least that is my idea, ive never tried it.
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  #23  
Old 04-19-2017, 07:52 AM
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That looks like a fancy boom stick. I just might need to start looking for a shotty. I love the versatility of shotguns too. The different style of ammo you can buy is crazy.
you can find shotguns pretty cheap. if you get a cheapo make sure you do not get an auto loader. I bought a tristar raptor. with would not cycle low brass shells as it was not adjustable. high brass it did great but my shoulder suffered. hardest recoil from an auto shotty I ever felt. I ended up with a CZ 610 18"1/2 inch barrel

also pistol grip shottys are loved by many but FAR less accurate. the myth is just aim it down a hall but at 15 feet you are still looking at a fairly tight pattern.

the shoulder is your 3rd point of contact and puts the barrel on the axis of your vision so you can make much more accurate point and fires.

mossberg makes a great entry level shotty, winchester and remington also have great tried and true offerings. then there are brands you might not have heard of for even cheaper. some are pretty good. do your research.
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  #24  
Old 04-19-2017, 08:33 AM
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pistol grip shottys are loved by many but FAR less accurate.
never heard this. does it translate to rifles also? if so why so manyrifles and shot guns have this?
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  #25  
Old 04-19-2017, 09:26 PM
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never heard this. does it translate to rifles also? if so why so manyrifles and shot guns have this?
I am just thinking here, but if it is true, I would point to the fact the pistol grip applies torque to the stock when fired. I do not think it applies to rifles, as the recoil is much lighter.
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  #26  
Old 04-21-2017, 11:18 AM
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i think it is just the fact that as one aims with a "stockless" firearm there is no rear solid pivot point to keep the sights aligned with the eye or the whole weapon for that matter.

I bought that M85 PAP AK-47 pistol, it is a hoot to shoot but damn it is hard to put on target and takes A LOT more time to align the sights where as if it had a stock I could pull to the shoulder and be right on. Also follow up shots are hard as even though this AK is 5.56 and has fairly low recoil it moves a lot.

test this yourself. buy a cheap $4 laser off ebay. tape the button "on" so it stays on. tape it to a yard stick as straight as you can then add a couple cans of beans or something for weight although this will not be full weight (a shotty will probably weigh 6-8# i reckon)

find a target 10-15 feet away. turn at a 45degree angle away then turn quickly and try to put the laser on the target. 1st by holding the yard stick like a stockless pistol grip shotty then like a shoulder fired shotty. while this is not super accurate I am sure you will find having the yard stick on your shoulder to start will allow much faster alignment and target acquisition where as the stockless variant will take a lot more time

then realize the laser helps with stockless IMMENSELY! without it you have to hold the stick out and use just the stick to align. much harder, not hard with the one with the stock.

anyway this is pure conjecture derived from anecdotal experience with limited real world physical knowledge. But I think while not definitive is fairly accurate. GF you have more experience with weapons that all of us put together. what is your feeling?

i have taken a few force on force training sessions. they changed my idea of a violent engagement involving fire arms. even the thought if getting hit with sims is terrifying as the brain still kind of thinks this is life or death as that is what you are training for.

I want the best chance I have to win a violent confrontation and I think if one chooses a shotty, an 18" barrel with a stock is by far the best choice.

like boxing the game is to hit the other guy without being hit. stakes are far greater in a confrontation with guns.
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  #27  
Old 04-21-2017, 09:09 PM
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i think it is just the fact that as one aims with a "stockless" firearm there is no rear solid pivot point to keep the sights aligned with the eye or the whole weapon for that matter.

I bought that M85 PAP AK-47 pistol, it is a hoot to shoot but damn it is hard to put on target and takes A LOT more time to align the sights where as if it had a stock I could pull to the shoulder and be right on. Also follow up shots are hard as even though this AK is 5.56 and has fairly low recoil it moves a lot.

test this yourself. buy a cheap $4 laser off ebay. tape the button "on" so it stays on. tape it to a yard stick as straight as you can then add a couple cans of beans or something for weight although this will not be full weight (a shotty will probably weigh 6-8# i reckon)

find a target 10-15 feet away. turn at a 45degree angle away then turn quickly and try to put the laser on the target. 1st by holding the yard stick like a stockless pistol grip shotty then like a shoulder fired shotty. while this is not super accurate I am sure you will find having the yard stick on your shoulder to start will allow much faster alignment and target acquisition where as the stockless variant will take a lot more time

then realize the laser helps with stockless IMMENSELY! without it you have to hold the stick out and use just the stick to align. much harder, not hard with the one with the stock.

anyway this is pure conjecture derived from anecdotal experience with limited real world physical knowledge. But I think while not definitive is fairly accurate. GF you have more experience with weapons that all of us put together. what is your feeling?

i have taken a few force on force training sessions. they changed my idea of a violent engagement involving fire arms. even the thought if getting hit with sims is terrifying as the brain still kind of thinks this is life or death as that is what you are training for.

I want the best chance I have to win a violent confrontation and I think if one chooses a shotty, an 18" barrel with a stock is by far the best choice.

like boxing the game is to hit the other guy without being hit. stakes are far greater in a confrontation with guns.
Sorry brother, I should have read your whole post that Acne responded to. I thought you all were talking about "full stocks" equipped with a pistol grip. There is a reason one of the seven elements to a good shooting position is placing the buttstock high in the shoulder pocket. Any weapon shoulder fired is going to be more accurate than the same weapon hip fired. Also, when point shooting, which is what you are doing in close quarters combat or self defense, you want your forward arm extended as far as possible. This makes point shooting more accurate and allows for quicker target acquisition. This is not practical if you do not have a stock in your shoulder.
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  #28  
Old 04-22-2017, 10:09 AM
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oh ok. i get it now. for every one here the statement is THIS is not as accurate


and THIS is great

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  #29  
Old 04-22-2017, 05:28 PM
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Correct
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Old 04-23-2017, 12:17 PM
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I do not understand your post acne, are you agreeing or disagreeing.
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